Problem child, advice?

[Leonard Hugo]

Some have seen my '85 460 this weekend at Helderberg 4x4 route and some questions have arisen as a result of being out for the first time.
The G was a 230GE and has had the engine replaced with a OM616. My idea was to fit the original 2.3 injection petrol engine (the more modern one with flattish+dark tappet cover) back into my G, but have changed my mind after seeing what the value of a diesel is offroad (climbs+declines). It has powersteering and had original aircon. I have a OM617 awaiting use and want to put that in instead. This got me thinking.

Some may have noticed my car slipping out of gear here and there which got worse on steep declines. I attributed this to loose linkages + mounting which is in part the case here. Closer inspection and cleaning muck then revealed my fears were accurate and the gearbox has a serial number (pic1) starting with R123. I assume this is not a good sign?)

Tracking down the original gearbox at some backyard mechanic in a township may be tricky to put it mildly. This would be the same "mechanic" that 'fixed' the leaking rear brakes by pinching closed the brake lines with a vice grip and leaving the vice grip there on the brake line. There are more complications to this but not relevant so let me not digress.

Here are my questions:

1: If I manage to find the box, what kind of serial number should I be looking for?

2: Will the OM617 (that came off an automatic W123 300D) fit on that box?

3: If so, will I be able to have my powersteering pump and aircon pump(from petrol motor) fitted to the OM617?

4: Will I need to have my radiator fitted with a extra row of pipes like on the W123 or would the existing original radiator do?

5:Will the flywheel off the 2.3 motor fit on the OM617 if needed?

6: Fan issues?

7: Does anybody recognise the universal joint/driveshaft as G?

8: Should there be a rubber inbetween the output shaft (gearbox) and universal?

9: Would I need a different sump and oil pickup put on the OM617?

10: Is the later model (original) 2.3 injection petrol engine with flattish/black tappet cover not more closely related to the W124?
Rendering this whole thought process null and void IF I manage to find the original gearbox? (as the OM617 would not fit it then)

Please excuse if some questions are vague, I dont have all the parts close at hand to inspect right away.

Would appreciate your input!
Thanks

Leonard

[munga]

Some have seen my '85 460 this weekend at Helderberg 4x4 route and some questions have arisen as a result of being out for the first time.
The G was a 230GE and has had the engine replaced with a OM616. My idea was to fit the original 2.3 injection petrol engine (the more modern one with flattish+dark tappet cover) back into my G, but have changed my mind after seeing what the value of a diesel is offroad (climbs+declines). It has powersteering and had original aircon. I have a OM617 awaiting use and want to put that in instead. This got me thinking.

Some may have noticed my car slipping out of gear here and there which got worse on steep declines. I attributed this to loose linkages + mounting which is in part the case here. Closer inspection and cleaning muck then revealed my fears were accurate and the gearbox has a serial number (pic1) starting with R123. I assume this is not a good sign?)

Tracking down the original gearbox at some backyard mechanic in a township may be tricky to put it mildly. This would be the same "mechanic" that 'fixed' the leaking rear brakes by pinching closed the brake lines with a vice grip and leaving the vice grip there on the brake line. There are more complications to this but not relevant so let me not digress.

Here are my questions:

1: If I manage to find the box, what kind of serial number should I be looking for?

2: Will the OM617 (that came off an automatic W123 300D) fit on that box?

3: If so, will I be able to have my powersteering pump and aircon pump(from petrol motor) fitted to the OM617?

4: Will I need to have my radiator fitted with a extra row of pipes like on the W123 or would the existing original radiator do?

5:Will the flywheel off the 2.3 motor fit on the OM617 if needed?

6: Fan issues?

7: Does anybody recognise the universal joint/driveshaft as G?

8: Should there be a rubber inbetween the output shaft (gearbox) and universal?

9: Would I need a different sump and oil pickup put on the OM617?

10: Is the later model (original) 2.3 injection petrol engine with flattish/black tappet cover not more closely related to the W124?
Rendering this whole thought process null and void IF I manage to find the original gearbox? (as the OM617 would not fit it then)

Please excuse if some questions are vague, I dont have all the parts close at hand to inspect right away.

Would appreciate your input!
Thanks

Leonard

IMO it would probably be easier and cheaper to go back to original. You are going to have more costs fitting the 617 than the motor that came with the car.

I prefer the diesel but also like the 230 motor after driving my brothers 230TE.

Honesty if the 230 motor is good rather fit that.

In terms of G sumps they are not a must. Many Gs have the sedan motors fitted without issue. They do serve a purpose though.

The OM617 flywheel weighs something like 17kg in the sedan. I am unsure about the G. Generally flywheels go together with specific engines.

G gearboxes are also different to the sedan. So ideally you would need a G gearbox too.

What VIN do you have?.

[Alan]

Hi Leonard,

With time comes wisdom and after doing some conversions myself I can also say the original was not as bad as I thought.

My first 230GE I converted to a 280(SE) with the automatic gearbox that came with it. I did need the larger tyres but overall performance was not that much better. I had no issues with the "car" motor and gearbox although I did manufacture the same seal on the rear of the gearbox to reduce dirt ingress.

IMHO. go with the 230 and if you don't have the original box get yourself a auto box to match. It isone of the nicest combinations.

Just my 1 zim cent.

[Riaan Harman]

I also think that the 230GE is a underestimated engine compared to the rest.

I enjoy mine a lot the lack of power isn't that much of an issue - You get use to it

R

[PUCHG]

230e has more power than 240GD, 300GD(5&6 cylinder), 290GD, 290GDT.

Think is a good combination between economy and power, very underestimated like you said.

[Leonard Hugo]

"I enjoy mine a lot the lack of power isn't that much of an issue - You get use to it" Compared to the 240d??


I would have gone original but a lot depends if the o that sold to me accepts my bribe to go look for the gearbox, which i suspect is a later model than the 240d or 300d (W123) would fit onto (similar to W124)?? Another little issue is the 2.3(original GE) condition is unknown. 3 years ago the original owner did a compression test that came within spec but anything could have happened since. All the petrol bits are still on the vehicle.
I have the auto box that was in the W123 300d I bought for the engine although that box came from a petrol W123?

One further question for now- Is there a petrol pump on the tank or engine? If on the tank, would this pump diesel just the same? I doubt anything was properly converted when this 240 was put in. Just really thankful nothing was cut or welded!

I do hope to find the guy has in fact gone looking for the original box this weekend...

Thanks for your advice thus far!

(yes, "W124" in the papers!)

[Marius Grobler]

230e has more power than 240GD, 300GD(5&6 cylinder), 290GD, 290GDT.

Think is a good combination between economy and power, very underestimated like you said.

I also understand Dastek offers a UNICHIP conversion without changing anything on the motor. Apparently this conversion provides 10% more power and torque with a total prive of approx R3000 fitted. Havent tried it yet but very keen as it does not involve any engine modifications as such.

[Rolf Redecker]

I can comment on the 230GE from my short experience with the 463 manual. Drove it from Windhoek to Cape Town full throttle all the way in mostly windy conditions (head/side winds) with roof carrier.
If it fell below 115 km/h (GPS) in fifth it could get back to 125 km/h in fourth virtually always, even on the uphills after the Orange river.
Compared to my 290 GD(T) it would maintain a slightly higher average speed because it reaches a higher top speed downhill but required frequent gear changes.
Fuel consumption: 17 to 18,4 l/100 km.

Regards
Rolf

[Riaan Harman]

I also understand Dastek offers a UNICHIP conversion without changing anything on the motor. Apparently this conversion provides 10% more power and torque with a total prive of approx R3000 fitted. Havent tried it yet but very keen as it does not involve any engine modifications as such.

The 230GE has a mechanical fuel injection don't think it can be done? If you have more info please!

[Riaan Harman]

I can comment on the 230GE from my short experience with the 463 manual. Drove it from Windhoek to Cape Town full throttle all the way in mostly windy conditions (head/side winds) with roof carrier.
If it fell below 115 km/h (GPS) in fifth it could get back to 125 km/h in fourth virtually always, even on the uphills after the Orange river.
Compared to my 290 GD(T) it would maintain a slightly higher average speed because it reaches a higher top speed downhill but required frequent gear changes.
Fuel consumption: 17 to 18,4 l/100 km.

Regards
Rolf

Totally agree Rolf, its just gear changing all the time but other than that the 230 is nice. Another 20kw would be nice though